The Art of Saying No & the Power of a Great Showreel | Ep 60

MAX: 00:13
Welcome back to Two Unemployed Actors. I'm Max. I'm Sam. We have after's short film to talk about. We have an update from Sam. That's him really excited to update it.

SAM: 00:26
Very excited.

MAX: 00:27
Shout out to listeners in Baltimore in Westminster. Yeah. I love that place. It's gonna be a long show. In Westminster in England, and it's Didney. Don't forget to like and subscribe. Good evening, good day, whatever, whatever time it is. And uh sh and um don't forget to subscribe on our social media platforms as well. Alright, welcome back. Got the business end out of the way.

SAM: 00:52
Yes.

MAX: 00:53
Talk about the fun stuff. The fun stuff. So a few weeks ago, I was on set for some production, some uh acting thing for corporate. Obviously, not that important. Well, it was because it paid the bills. A friend of mine messaged me going, I've just had to drop out due to timing for a student film. I'm like, okay, student film, because you know I'm not doing any more free stuff. And I'm like, oh, I don't know. It's a really cool shoot. We'll get you the script. Um, it's afters, so great, you know, great uh um uh great school. So I'm like, okay, my ears are up. I'm I I can do this. Had a look at the script, it was really interesting because not just because it's different to what I've been doing, you know, actor, lawyer, father, husband, um, really full-on, heavily medicated, alcoholic construction worker who's, you know, in a not great place after the wife has died with his relationship with the daughter. Wow.

SAM: 01:46
Oh, this you you spoke a little bit about this, but yeah, yeah, yeah.

MAX: 01:49
Layer upon layer of duma.

SAM: 01:51
So I can't help yourself, you just gotta get once you get off of the roll, you have to do it no matter what.

MAX: 01:55
Well, well, it depends. I know I've said no to a few things, let me assure you, over the last few weeks.

SAM: 01:59
I think it's important, equally as important to know when to say no.

MAX: 02:02
To be able to filter prodigiously, and I think experience allows you to do that because sometimes it's just as important what you say no to.

SAM: 02:07
That's true.

MAX: 02:07
Because when you're committing, you're committing to a rehearsal day, you're committing to a few days on set. That's time.

SAM: 02:14
A lot of your time and skill.

MAX: 02:15
And that's time I'm not working, uh doing voiceovers. Maybe not as much skill. Well, uh I like to think so. Um at least I'm only lying to myself. So uh and then you're committing to days you can't do auditions, days you can't do castings, days you can't do your corporate work. So um I thought, you know, it's it's it's a really important thing. And so I I looked at the script, it was really good. We had a little Zoom catch up, the producers, the writer, director, um, and myself, and it just gave me more and more confidence in it.

Speaker 3: 02:45
Cool.

MAX: 02:45
And I think previously I spoke to how they were struggling to find people because they're like, oh, the character's a bit the character's an arsehole, you know, whereas I'm sort of sort of looking into that character with my life experience going, he doesn't wake up intending to, you know, yeah, provide harm onto someone.

SAM: 02:58
Oh, that's right. You had a different insight than the other ones?

MAX: 03:01
Yeah, he just he's just flawed as a human being, and that's okay. Um so I felt confident being able to bring it to life. What was interesting was the on the on the days of the shoot, especially the real heavily intense scenes, the ones where we're going full on at each other, myself um and Amy Patmore played uh my daughter, who who was going full on aggressive to me. Like we're just really having it out. It's been filmed. You filmed it, yeah, yeah, yeah. So on those days, it was really interesting how we both had different ways to approach the character. Like, I was pretty relaxed because like I've I've played it different ways, um, shortlisted those ways in rehearsal, so it kind of felt I felt really confident on the day.

SAM: 03:45
Yeah, right.

MAX: 03:46
So that allowed me some freedom to be in the moment and sort of have a play in the moment. But leading up to these scenes, what was really interesting and and and fantastic, um, Ruby, who was directing, just made a really nice safe space and said, Look, you know, we're gonna have minimal crew in the room. Um we're, you know, this is a couple hours before, even we're gonna we're gonna have minimal crew in the room. Feel free to spend some time in the space and just relax, get to know the space, have a run through if you want to. I also let Amy know that I'm ready to do line reads or or rehearsal wherever you need. She was in her own space, literally in her car outside, just going through what she needed to do to get into the right space for a very full and emotional scene. I let her know that I'm available if she needed me for anything. And I was in the space having a little joke around as I do and sort of getting the hang of the how the shot's gonna be set up, that sort of thing. Um and I think that really allowed us, although we were very different in how we approached it, both Amy and myself, it allowed us to really turn up and be ready 100% to commit to this to this scene. And and because it's okay, I don't mind if everyone's everyone's got their own different approaches, whatever helps them to turn up and be ready so that we can just go for it. And that allows me to explore more in the moment. So by that I mean, you know, when we were in the scene, we were ready to go, uh, we do a run through, um, and the director's kind of looking at the run through, thinking about camera placement and all that sort of stuff as well. Yeah, right. Because certain things might hit, like, wow, that that moment's really good, we should capture it this way. So, um, and and the set decoration was perfect and it was 360, so they had the flip freedom to move with the camera placement.

SAM: 05:31
Okay, cool.

MAX: 05:32
So it really it really allowed the setup for the most successful opportunity for two actors.

SAM: 05:40
Yeah as well.

MAX: 05:40
Absolutely, and and that allowed us to really just the freedom to move because we knew the camera wasn't fixed. Yeah, it could be placed anywhere. We knew that we were both ready. Uh, we had the confidence from rehearsals, we um both loved the characters and the script.

SAM: 05:57
So, in this particular emotional scene, what was it about? Can you tell it?

MAX: 06:00
Um it's like a final confrontation where it's escalated, it's stepped up a notch, and yet somewhere during this scene, they both realize what's going on, and it's not healthy, and we're actually dealing with the trauma. Yeah, right. We're just dealing with it differently. We're in the same sort of headspace in terms of trauma, just dealing with it very differently. And in a way, the daughters had to step up and look after the dad, and it's come to a head. We're both exhausted. So I'm sliding off the couch, she's sliding down the wall, and we're boom, it just sort of hits us, and we're like, Fuck. So it's obviously I'm not a script writer because there were a few more few more layers to it. Yeah, but um, but yeah, we just yell at each other and go, oh fuck, okay. All right, let's go get some takeout. So um What are you American? So it was really it was really interesting. I really enjoyed, I really enjoyed the process. And then when we finally got to the scene, it just flowed like it was on fire. It was it was it was intense.

SAM: 07:00
Do you do a few takes as well?

MAX: 07:01
Yeah, we did a few, and then we had this really unique opportunity where Ruby came in and said, Look, we're gonna give you the camera. We're gonna set it up over there in the corner, we're gonna leave the room, you guys, you know, do the sound. You guys clap the sound, you guys say cut, and then we come back. It's up to as long as you feel like you've got it. If you haven't got it, you can do it again. So I'm like, okay, this is really cool. So it really is just her character and my character, and we're just gonna go for it and and and have a play in that space on our own.

SAM: 07:36
And was that better than with uh some of them in the room? Do you feel?

MAX: 07:40
For me, I mean, I didn't really mind. I was looking forward to another run through because there was a couple of things I wanted to try, yeah technically, but um, you know, I don't care if there's a hundred thousand people or whatever, because I'd sort of lose myself and I've got tunnel vision, I'm thinking about the character's mindset.

Speaker 1: 07:54
100%.

MAX: 07:55
Um, but it was a really unique, I've never had the opportunity before, so I'm like, I don't know, let's have a look and see how it goes. So we're we're ready to go, and um, we give ourselves the cue, we clap, action, and we're into it, and we're going for it. And it just felt like boom, we were just so we're just so into it. Nice. And then got all the rehearsals behind us, a few great takes behind us as well. So we just knew it's in the bag, so this is like one extra. And we were just going for it, going off the rails, and and um and then I'm like, cut, and I felt so good, like we really got something amazing. And it just so happened that where the framing was, she was right Amy's Amy, she Amy was right on the the right side of camera, and I'm right on the left side of camera, just in frame, and we're just absolutely going for each other. There's moments we get close, moments we get further apart, and we just finish at the same s uh place in the frame, but opposite. Oh, very cool. And I'm like, can't they all come back in and I'm smiling, Amy's smiling, like, yeah, we got it, whatever. We looked back on on the front. We look back on it. I only looked at a bit of because I'm I'm really not too keen on seeing myself.

SAM: 09:05
Yeah.

MAX: 09:05
How do you find like when you've got because you've got the monitor there?

SAM: 09:08
I like so so I I like um watching it back sometimes just to s just because I love seeing the world through the lens of a camera, it looks so much better. Um in my early, early, like much earlier days, like I hated watching myself and listening myself because of singing I had to as well. Oh, of course. And it and it takes like it takes some time, like I I've gotten a bit used to it, but I don't like really watching myself unless I'm trying to actually do better or learn from something. Okay. So yes, I'm in agreement with you.

MAX: 09:40
Yeah, I don't really look for it. I think unless there's something technical, like it's uh it's it's comedy timing or something, or something's got to happen as I do in action, you know, and it sets off a chain reaction. I've just got to make sure I've got that right. But um, but yeah, and I and I didn't. I chose not to on this particular occasion. Anyway, the I left the room because I'm like, I'm my heart rate's up there. I'm I'm fully going still. I'm like, I just want to get out of the character, you know. So I'm just like um having a chat to a neighbour who was asking what was going on, and quite rightly too, in the apartment block, it was quite a lot of noise. We're having the same fight over and over and over. So I had a little chat to them, which helped me, and I realizing later I looked like the full alcoholic. I had the makeup on, you know, the they know it was a shooting, but yeah, they did then. Um so it was really interesting. So it took me out of the mindset. Sometimes music helps me too, but anyway, um, director was happy, writer was happy, so everyone's happy. That makes me happy if they're smiling. Yeah, yeah, and I said, Yeah, it felt really good. How did that look? And she's like, it was amazing. And then when you yelled cut, you just put your arms up in the air and you're like, Yeah, like I didn't realize. So obviously, I was happy with it. Yeah, um, so it worked out quite well. And their brief for the assessment was to have a five-minute film. What they found is they've got over ten minutes that they can really use. So they've they had two cuts, one for their submission for afters for the school.

SAM: 11:01
That has to be five minutes?

MAX: 11:02
Yes, there has to be five minutes, and the other is what we'd call the director's cut. I'm so looking forward to seeing it. I haven't seen it yet. Which is a longer version. Yeah, the to the 10-minute movie. So I'm I'm so excited to see it because I really love it. From the moment I looked at the script, I'm like, I could really see this a certain way. Oh, cool. And that's the way I saw my character the whole way through. So it was really interesting.

SAM: 11:23
That's always so much fun when you click with your character straight away.

MAX: 11:26
And it all happens, and everyone on set, like there's no passengers. Remembering too, this is in the thick of COVID, and in Australia, afters is the school that wrote COVID guidelines that were then picked up by the industry and then picked up overseas. Really? So we're talking pressure. You just did it. Yeah.

SAM: 11:43
Because they were pretty strict, I do remember that because I had to go in for recording for a short film that I did and the nurse on the front door and everything. No, we wouldn't allow it weren't allowed in those early days, so yeah. Well, they weren't very strict.

MAX: 11:54
They actually had a COVID monitor, and the COVID monitor would was one of the teachers who was briefed on the guidelines that would then turn up ran at a random moment on set and or during rehearsals, and just stand in the corner being the creepy person with their covert shirt going, is that 1.5 metres apart? What was interesting is that it really involved a lot of tension up close, and the apartment wasn't huge. So some scenes in the kitchen, we had to really cheat it quite carefully because we'd get this amazing setup, and then it'd be like, But the camera can't. We've got the camera guy's got to fit in there. Yeah, yeah, the cinematographer's got to fit in there, and they have to be 1.5 metres apart. So uh other other moments, it the problem solving helped us get a better frame, a better setup, yeah, right, and a better scene. So because it really made us think like we got it in terms of how we wanted the characters positioned, then great, we got it technically, because that's the other thing, you know, making sure that lighting was right and everyone was still 1.5, yeah, and it looked so good that we had to get someone to take a photo of the setup to make sure that if they asked a question, we could prove that we were 1.5 meters apart. Because there'd be nothing more embarrassing than the body that that makes the guidelines getting a couple of sets shut down because of the COVID. So you know what I mean? So it's masks on and behave, and which I have to say we we did really well. And I think if we can like I said to the guys, if you can pull off a short film with such intensity and such closeness um during COVID, you'd be fine.

SAM: 13:20
Yeah, you'd be fine.

MAX: 13:21
Because there were moments where everything worked perfectly, and then we're like, damn it, the COVID, because technically we had to get even the camera and lighting 1.5 metres apart, as I said, and it worked out perfectly, and then we're like, damn it, for technical reasons we couldn't. So to cheat the close-up where the camera would be on a you know upper c upper c upper crate behind me, up high to be 1.5 metres apart, then zooming in to make it look like it's just a normal over-the-shoulder shot. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it had to be a certain eye line because it had to look like I'm looking down at the food because the it starts close with the food at the bottom of the the fridge because she had an eating disorder, and then it zooms out to see me looking at it, and then keep zooming to show the full scene. So it was really complicated, but we got there. And fortunately, they were smart enough to allow three days to film instead of the normal two for this assessment. Just so they could go around there because there's so much extra, but we found ourselves extra time, even to the point where the last full-on emotional scene, which they left to shoot last, which was thankful again because it was all building up to that moment. Um, said, Look, you know, are you happy to do it again? Do you want to do improv? Do you want to like I'm like, you know what? I think we've got it. Yeah, yeah. So we're really happy with that. So look, it was a great shoot. I'm I'm looking forward to it. As soon as I'm able to share the film, I will on all the two unemployed socials that uh because every now and then you come across a project that you really gel with and everything works technically. The crew is super professional, and you just can't wait to see the finished product.

SAM: 14:50
Yeah, nice.

MAX: 14:51
And that's that's one of them. Cool. Yay, and other than that, it's been busy with the rehearsals for play. I've had to bump this week's rehearsal because I've got a I'm on hold for something tomorrow. Corporate gig Thursday night presenting for the wine. Yeah. So hopefully it doesn't result in the hangover on the Friday.

Speaker 3: 15:08
Yep.

MAX: 15:10
And uh and uh I just had a call back for um a rather large corporate gig on Monday, actually.

SAM: 15:18
So nice. It's all happening. This is all through the agent.

MAX: 15:21
No, that was all me. The agent did give me a Star Now stuff. Oh no, this is the yeah, yeah. Star now. So the the agent did give me an opportunity with uh through Daniel Long casting for a um Sydney Water television commercial actually that I did a self-tape for on Monday. So literally the lights have been set up. It's my dining room without a dining table is basically been the rehearsal space. I've been doing laps with my scripts for the play with the dog looking at me like I'm crazy, and also you know, doing self-tape up for self-tape. So it's it's working out quite well. I might regret actually getting a dining table.

SAM: 15:54
Um just don't get one. You need on the floor, see it on the floor.

MAX: 15:57
Actors laugh.

SAM: 15:58
Yeah, exactly.

MAX: 15:59
So it's been it's been quite good. It's all about the acting, less about the voiceovers. It's funny how the universe sort of works itself out.

SAM: 16:04
Yeah, nice. Well, um that that feature film that I got into, that Jess and I got into, uh we had our read-through last night. Had it go uh over Zoom. Zoom's a funny one to have a read-through with. There's a lot of pauses where there's not meant to be. Yeah, um, but yeah, it we didn't have everyone. We're gonna have everyone figure out data how get everyone there, it's just some people were busy. Okay. But it was very cool uh to see Cameron again, the director and the writer, um, and actually go through the script word for word, stage directions also.

MAX: 16:32
Had it changed the draft since the one No, we still use the one that that he sent through.

SAM: 16:37
Um and because that was I think his draft seven anyway. Yeah. Uh yeah. Um but it took it took about two and a half hours to get through, just um or maybe just two hours or something like that. Uh but it was good, it met a few other people, all the all all the other characters as well, and it was cool to meet all the other actors playing the other characters. And it was good to go through the script and it's quite funny. It's actually quite a funny script. Um and it is based a bit on the like loosely on the director's kind of life outside after HSC. Okay. So it's gonna be cool. We're all gonna have some fun. Like, I it's gonna be a fun one, just kind of chill out but work hard as well.

MAX: 17:17
Put 100% in, but it's I think that's the one where it looks like you've had lots of fun because you did, you enjoyed her, but that's because you did the homework.

SAM: 17:23
Yes. Well, actually, when I so when I did the audition, so um most of these characters are virgins and young, whatever.

MAX: 17:30
Inexperienced in life.

SAM: 17:31
Mine's he mine's a little he's a little bit of a bitch, and he's uh we've all met one of those. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm not looking, I wasn't looking at you. I was looking at you. Oh, you bastards. No, but um so during the audition, right after the first script, uh, I think it was his uh the director's dad who was also sitting in on it as well. Oh right. But he said to me, Yeah, that was really no like really nice and subtle. You play a virgin really well. And I said, and I said, uh, yeah, method. Um and he knew that like Jess was my girlfriend. He's like, Yeah, you guys for a while, eh? Yeah, it was quite funny. No, it was funny. Um that's cool. And I was like, that's what I'm here for, to pull that off. So that's pretty good. And I was and obviously got the wrong that's good, that's good. But yeah, uh it was it was really good to it's always good to read through the script, bring it to life a bit, yeah. And hear how all the other actors think their characters alike as well.

MAX: 18:30
Have you had much time to talk to the director like one-on-one about your character and sort of development? Not yet, but we will have some ideas, obviously.

SAM: 18:37
Yeah, and he's he's kind of like, look, this script is not concrete. I want you guys to play around with it. Okay. Technically, like in this idea, you kind of just gotta play yourself because they're just teens out of the city. Take elements of yourself, yeah. And partying and drugs and chill and drunk. Like that's you can relate to that. I do all the drugs, he's this character, yeah. Um so so yeah, I think it's gonna be quite quite chill in the acting realm for my character at least, because he doesn't do much anyway. But um it's gonna be great fun and that's great, put some stuff on my show reel and get it out there.

MAX: 19:11
Did you talk tell your agent? Because I think there was a few of you from Yeah, I haven't told him yet.

SAM: 19:15
Um I'm gonna tell him. I was going to tell work that's that's important. Yeah. Uh you can't be in two places at once. Yeah, exactly. But I am gonna tell my agent. Um I should tell the other guys to tell them, tell them as well, because we're all get the okay, get the clearance from all of you as you buy as your chat or something.

MAX: 19:33
It's good too that the agent knows what you're doing and you know what I mean? What that you're still committed and you're and you're getting more and more experience actually.

SAM: 19:41
100%. And I I am actually I'm planning on finishing my show real off. I need to finish that and shove it onto casting networks because I don't actually have anything up there. Yes. Because that doesn't make a significant difference with getting rolls.

MAX: 19:50
I mean, look, even if people aren't look r religiously watching it from the first second to the last second, it adds credibility to you as a professional actor.

Speaker 3: 19:58
Yeah.

MAX: 19:59
And it's easy for casting directors and and and you know, directors to see you um working on a set um and go, great, I know we can work on a set.

SAM: 20:08
And they're gonna skip over a lot of the ones without them. Ones with just headshots. I mean, it's gonna be you know, they say, Oh cool, but they want to see something.

MAX: 20:14
It helps because to see an actor moving and talking and doing is what they do, is exactly to see on on camera. Because it's I mean, so many times you see people with headshots that just look so different to what they actually look like in real life, let alone to how many and and doesn't do justice how many characters they can bring.

SAM: 20:30
Of course, yeah, even if it's spot-on accurate portrayal of what you look like, it still doesn't show them your acting, you know.

MAX: 20:36
I think I'm up to draft uh whatever on my yeah, on my on my show. But I'm super happy with the reel I've got. I'm looking forward to adding in the um Water Under the Bridge, which is the title of the afters film. Can't wait. And I've got a presenting to camera reel, which when I see the MITA 10 and the car sales drop, I'll add those in to that one as well. Um because obviously my bread and butter tends to be more aligned to the corporate presenting to camera. Um, not so much the television commercial audition I did yesterday, but but like the the corporate work I'm doing Thursday night, that's presenting to camera. Yeah, right. The Friday, the Monday one, the big job, if I get that, will be presenting to camera. So um it's great to have a reel that sort of showcases that because the big jobs from Star Now as well, did you say that? Uh yeah, yeah. I mean, you know, it's a couple of grand to present to camera for a business and be their induction video for a certain amount of time, like six months or me. Yeah, good stuff. Um which is great. And then the other one is the wine company, where it's going to turn to regular regular stuff here, isn't it? So back again uh for 2.0 this Thursday night. Perfect. And uh he was really excited because he's got a new videographer who's does a lot of work on ESPN and has a really rich history in bringing amazing stuff to life on on film on camera. So good stuff. I'm looking forward to that and a and a professional production. Company which bumps it up a notch from where I was previously working with them who's just going to package it all up and that's what they do all the time and and and give uh Avron a copy of you know the best of so that they can get approval from the board and we can move forward.

Speaker 1: 22:15
Nice.

MAX: 22:16
So the boring business bits behind the scenes, but yeah, I mean two show reels that are getting me work, so I can't complain.

SAM: 22:21
And you've got a lot of voiceovers. You've been doing a lot of voiceovers.

MAX: 22:23
I wouldn't say a lot, actually. It's really funny. I thought the acting would die off this time of year. Like we're talking, like it's the 15th of Christmas of Christmas, 15th of December. Yeah. But I'm busier now as companies are really trying to. I mean, it's a it's an abnormal year. It is. COVID's almost behind us. Everyone's back in the city working now. Uh the restrictions are are eased. Um, so it's a nice place to be in Sydney. And we don't obviously people aren't going to travel overseas. So what's the city? Normally, normally Sydney's dead in January from now until pretty much after New Year's, it just dies until school's back.

SAM: 22:57
But all productions are jumping straight on to it.

MAX: 22:59
Yeah, like everyone's rushing, and businesses, particularly with the corporate work, are rushing to get stuff done before Christmas break. So um what's weird is yeah, I've got lots of that stuff, and then the the voiceover stuff, even the auditions have dropped a bit. Um, but that's again the universe walking working out for me, so I'm still working normal hours. It's just more on the acting stuff, which is which is great. And setting up the like it's so much easier having the the studio lights and um the setup downstairs because it doesn't matter what time of day or night I'm recording, I've still got the same consistency, excuse me. And I think with some with some films where I really some audition tapes where I really edit quite a bit in there, yeah. Um, you know, it I might look at it and go, oh, I'm really missing this kind of element, and then go back from the editing chair to actually redo it again. And at least it can drop straight in because everything's consistent, everything being, you know, lighting, which is most important. Sure. So yes, so it's been wow, yeah, it's been busy. It's been busy. Yeah. I'm looking forward to Sunday with I think we're going from 2 30 till 8 p.m. doing a few run throughs of the play in its entirety.

SAM: 24:08
Enjoy, yeah, yeah.

MAX: 24:09
Because it's such a physical comedy, there's lots of running around and bumping into each other.

SAM: 24:13
Awesome.

MAX: 24:14
I'm really having to work hard on that. Yeah, work hard. It's not so much being off book word wise, it's blocking. So I'll give you more info on that next episode. So, yes, you've been listening to two unemployed actors. I'm Max.

SAM: 24:26
I am Sam.

MAX: 24:27
And you'll hear us again next week.

SAM: 24:28
See you guys. Bye